<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Arrogant Linux Elitists</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.lostwebsite.net/2009/05/arrogant_linux_elitists/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.lostwebsite.net/2009/05/arrogant_linux_elitists/</link>
	<description>You Are Here</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Thu, 26 Aug 2010 22:39:07 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0.1</generator>
	<item>
		<title>By: Top Posts &#171; WordPress.com</title>
		<link>http://www.lostwebsite.net/2009/05/arrogant_linux_elitists/comment-page-1/#comment-49</link>
		<dc:creator>Top Posts &#171; WordPress.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2009 00:11:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lostwebsite.wordpress.com/2009/05/10/163/#comment-49</guid>
		<description>[...]  Arrogant Linux Elitists Update It was pointed to me from Reddit and from a commenter that the -f flag in rm -rf is the force flag and [...] [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...]  Arrogant Linux Elitists Update It was pointed to me from Reddit and from a commenter that the -f flag in rm -rf is the force flag and [...] [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Good safeguards &#171; lostwebsite.net blog</title>
		<link>http://www.lostwebsite.net/2009/05/arrogant_linux_elitists/comment-page-1/#comment-48</link>
		<dc:creator>Good safeguards &#171; lostwebsite.net blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2009 13:19:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lostwebsite.wordpress.com/2009/05/10/163/#comment-48</guid>
		<description>[...] one comment  In my last post I&#8217;ve shown that some people are annoyed at the fact that they can no longer erase their root [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] one comment  In my last post I&#8217;ve shown that some people are annoyed at the fact that they can no longer erase their root [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: fdgonthier</title>
		<link>http://www.lostwebsite.net/2009/05/arrogant_linux_elitists/comment-page-1/#comment-47</link>
		<dc:creator>fdgonthier</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2009 02:45:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lostwebsite.wordpress.com/2009/05/10/163/#comment-47</guid>
		<description>Actually, this was made part of the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/9699919799/utilities/rm.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;POSIX standard&lt;/a&gt; before the GNU people implemented it.  Solaris has the same behavior since.

The same standard also says that rm -rf . should return an error.  GNU coreutils does, and its documented: http://www.gnu.org/software/coreutils/manual/coreutils.html#rm-invocation

So, I kinda fail to see your point there...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually, this was made part of the <a href="http://www.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/9699919799/utilities/rm.html" rel="nofollow">POSIX standard</a> before the GNU people implemented it.  Solaris has the same behavior since.</p>
<p>The same standard also says that rm -rf . should return an error.  GNU coreutils does, and its documented: <a href="http://www.gnu.org/software/coreutils/manual/coreutils.html#rm-invocation" rel="nofollow">http://www.gnu.org/software/coreutils/manual/coreutils.html#rm-invocation</a></p>
<p>So, I kinda fail to see your point there&#8230;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Alfred M. Szmidt</title>
		<link>http://www.lostwebsite.net/2009/05/arrogant_linux_elitists/comment-page-1/#comment-46</link>
		<dc:creator>Alfred M. Szmidt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2009 02:41:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lostwebsite.wordpress.com/2009/05/10/163/#comment-46</guid>
		<description>Thank you for your comment Robert!

   This action is typical of the arrogance of GNU. When I switch
   between different Unixes, I want the core commands to be as similar
   as possible, and GNU happily ignores standards and conventions.

The GNU project follow standards quite stricly (specially if you set
the POSIXLY_CORRECT enviromental variable), and in this case, we
follow them as well.  There is nothing in the standards (POSIX
1003.1-2001 and onwards) that prohibits this type of behaviour.

Another common example of where people think we broke things on
purpose is the case of `head +2&#039;, POSIX 1003.1-2001 changed this to
mean something different (show the beginning of the file +2, instead
of showing the first two lines), so with POSIX 1003.1-2001 and onward,
you must use `head -n2&#039; to show the first two lines of a file.

   rm -rf / isn&#039;t any more dangerous when logged in as a standard user
   than running rm -rf . when $PWD=$HOME.  While I admire the
   intention, it doesn&#039;t actual protect you from anything much, and
   breaks the behaviour of a standard tool.  Backups and not being
   stupid as root are the solutions.

Maybe it isn&#039;t dangrous as percived, but users requested the feature
and the feature is useful, so we implemented it.  You can still get
the old behaviour using --no-preserve-root, it is a win-win situation
for all parties.

   Oh and GNU/Linux? Come on... as far as my daily interactions go, I
   should probably call it LaTeX/KDE/Linux before I call it
   GNU/Linux. Oh, what, you say, they&#039;re built on GNU tools? Well, the
   GNU tools require glibc too. You can&#039;t have it both ways.

You have fallen in to the common trap of thinking that GNU is a set of
tools, it isn&#039;t, it is a free operating system.  The GNU C library
(glibc) is one of the many parts of the system that we wrote, to
complete the system.  Linus wrote a important missing part, the Linux
kernel, and completed the GNU system in the form of GNU/Linux.  You
can read more about this at:

* http://www.gnu.org/gnu/why-gnu-linux.html

* http://www.gnu.org/gnu/linux-and-gnu.html

* http://www.gnu.org/gnu/gnu-users-never-heard-of-gnu.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you for your comment Robert!</p>
<p>   This action is typical of the arrogance of GNU. When I switch<br />
   between different Unixes, I want the core commands to be as similar<br />
   as possible, and GNU happily ignores standards and conventions.</p>
<p>The GNU project follow standards quite stricly (specially if you set<br />
the POSIXLY_CORRECT enviromental variable), and in this case, we<br />
follow them as well.  There is nothing in the standards (POSIX<br />
1003.1-2001 and onwards) that prohibits this type of behaviour.</p>
<p>Another common example of where people think we broke things on<br />
purpose is the case of `head +2&#8242;, POSIX 1003.1-2001 changed this to<br />
mean something different (show the beginning of the file +2, instead<br />
of showing the first two lines), so with POSIX 1003.1-2001 and onward,<br />
you must use `head -n2&#8242; to show the first two lines of a file.</p>
<p>   rm -rf / isn&#8217;t any more dangerous when logged in as a standard user<br />
   than running rm -rf . when $PWD=$HOME.  While I admire the<br />
   intention, it doesn&#8217;t actual protect you from anything much, and<br />
   breaks the behaviour of a standard tool.  Backups and not being<br />
   stupid as root are the solutions.</p>
<p>Maybe it isn&#8217;t dangrous as percived, but users requested the feature<br />
and the feature is useful, so we implemented it.  You can still get<br />
the old behaviour using &#8211;no-preserve-root, it is a win-win situation<br />
for all parties.</p>
<p>   Oh and GNU/Linux? Come on&#8230; as far as my daily interactions go, I<br />
   should probably call it LaTeX/KDE/Linux before I call it<br />
   GNU/Linux. Oh, what, you say, they&#8217;re built on GNU tools? Well, the<br />
   GNU tools require glibc too. You can&#8217;t have it both ways.</p>
<p>You have fallen in to the common trap of thinking that GNU is a set of<br />
tools, it isn&#8217;t, it is a free operating system.  The GNU C library<br />
(glibc) is one of the many parts of the system that we wrote, to<br />
complete the system.  Linus wrote a important missing part, the Linux<br />
kernel, and completed the GNU system in the form of GNU/Linux.  You<br />
can read more about this at:</p>
<p>* <a href="http://www.gnu.org/gnu/why-gnu-linux.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.gnu.org/gnu/why-gnu-linux.html</a></p>
<p>* <a href="http://www.gnu.org/gnu/linux-and-gnu.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.gnu.org/gnu/linux-and-gnu.html</a></p>
<p>* <a href="http://www.gnu.org/gnu/gnu-users-never-heard-of-gnu.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.gnu.org/gnu/gnu-users-never-heard-of-gnu.html</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Robert</title>
		<link>http://www.lostwebsite.net/2009/05/arrogant_linux_elitists/comment-page-1/#comment-45</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2009 02:10:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lostwebsite.wordpress.com/2009/05/10/163/#comment-45</guid>
		<description>This action is typical of the arrogance of GNU. When I switch between different Unixes, I want the core commands to be as similar as possible, and GNU happily ignores standards and conventions.

rm -rf / isn&#039;t any more dangerous when logged in as a standard user than running rm -rf . when $PWD=$HOME. While I admire the intention, it doesn&#039;t actual protect you from anything much, and breaks the behaviour of a standard tool. Backups and not being stupid as root are the solutions.

Oh and GNU/Linux? Come on... as far as my daily interactions go, I should probably call it LaTeX/KDE/Linux before I call it GNU/Linux. Oh, what, you say, they&#039;re built on GNU tools? Well, the GNU tools require glibc too. You can&#039;t have it both ways.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This action is typical of the arrogance of GNU. When I switch between different Unixes, I want the core commands to be as similar as possible, and GNU happily ignores standards and conventions.</p>
<p>rm -rf / isn&#8217;t any more dangerous when logged in as a standard user than running rm -rf . when $PWD=$HOME. While I admire the intention, it doesn&#8217;t actual protect you from anything much, and breaks the behaviour of a standard tool. Backups and not being stupid as root are the solutions.</p>
<p>Oh and GNU/Linux? Come on&#8230; as far as my daily interactions go, I should probably call it LaTeX/KDE/Linux before I call it GNU/Linux. Oh, what, you say, they&#8217;re built on GNU tools? Well, the GNU tools require glibc too. You can&#8217;t have it both ways.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: cahsholeh</title>
		<link>http://www.lostwebsite.net/2009/05/arrogant_linux_elitists/comment-page-1/#comment-44</link>
		<dc:creator>cahsholeh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 May 2009 22:54:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lostwebsite.wordpress.com/2009/05/10/163/#comment-44</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m Linux user... thx, I can learn here...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m Linux user&#8230; thx, I can learn here&#8230;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: fdgonthier</title>
		<link>http://www.lostwebsite.net/2009/05/arrogant_linux_elitists/comment-page-1/#comment-43</link>
		<dc:creator>fdgonthier</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 May 2009 17:28:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lostwebsite.wordpress.com/2009/05/10/163/#comment-43</guid>
		<description>I still don&#039;t understand your initial comment.  A lot of Linux user love the feeling of power the operating system is giving them.  This is true of Linux but also of older commercial versions of Unix.  Unix has always been about giving user maximum power and maximum possibilities.

Elitists fear the new wave of Linux user.  Fuelled by the arrival of those new users, Linux develpers add new safeguards easier configuration a slew of changes that make the system easier to use, which, for elistists, also means less powerful.  I think this is rarely the case though because the underlying system hasn&#039;t changed that much.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I still don&#8217;t understand your initial comment.  A lot of Linux user love the feeling of power the operating system is giving them.  This is true of Linux but also of older commercial versions of Unix.  Unix has always been about giving user maximum power and maximum possibilities.</p>
<p>Elitists fear the new wave of Linux user.  Fuelled by the arrival of those new users, Linux develpers add new safeguards easier configuration a slew of changes that make the system easier to use, which, for elistists, also means less powerful.  I think this is rarely the case though because the underlying system hasn&#8217;t changed that much.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: pochp</title>
		<link>http://www.lostwebsite.net/2009/05/arrogant_linux_elitists/comment-page-1/#comment-42</link>
		<dc:creator>pochp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 May 2009 16:18:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lostwebsite.wordpress.com/2009/05/10/163/#comment-42</guid>
		<description>OK Steven. I see your point. But i still think my initial comment makes a point.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OK Steven. I see your point. But i still think my initial comment makes a point.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Steven Pigeon</title>
		<link>http://www.lostwebsite.net/2009/05/arrogant_linux_elitists/comment-page-1/#comment-41</link>
		<dc:creator>Steven Pigeon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 May 2009 14:46:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lostwebsite.wordpress.com/2009/05/10/163/#comment-41</guid>
		<description>Elitism here refers to dudes that think they cannot possibly make an error typing a command, or while writing a script and brag irrationally about it. I don&#039;t think it has anything to do with free (as in beer).

@fdgonthier: Neither do I. It doesn&#039;t make sense at all on a running system.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Elitism here refers to dudes that think they cannot possibly make an error typing a command, or while writing a script and brag irrationally about it. I don&#8217;t think it has anything to do with free (as in beer).</p>
<p>@fdgonthier: Neither do I. It doesn&#8217;t make sense at all on a running system.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: fdgonthier</title>
		<link>http://www.lostwebsite.net/2009/05/arrogant_linux_elitists/comment-page-1/#comment-40</link>
		<dc:creator>fdgonthier</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 May 2009 14:44:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lostwebsite.wordpress.com/2009/05/10/163/#comment-40</guid>
		<description>I... really don&#039;t see your point.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8230; really don&#8217;t see your point.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
